Nieuport 12 - scorers

[Knusel]

Hello there Gentlemen,

you see a Nieuport that shows outward-leaning interplane V-struts, inverted-V-shape front centre struts and slab-sided side fairings ?: that's a Nieuport 12.
I know these scorers:

1. Herbert Simms 24Apr1916
2. Robert de Marolles 28Apr1916
3. Geoffrey Boumphrey 5Feb1917

Cheers,

Michael

[Knusel]

...maybe also Miodrag Miletic.

http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/sh...hlight=miletic
http://aces.safarikovi.org/victories/serbia-ww1.html

Can anybody tell me more about his score ?

Michael

[Knusel]

Good evening Gentlemen,

according to "Sopwith Pup Aces of World War 1" by Norman Franks Stuart Pratt claimed two Nieuport 12 kills in 46Sq. However, the 15Feb kill was in a Nieuport 20 and the Mar1917 kill may have never happened, correct ?

Cheers,

Michael

[Graeme]

Hello Michael

I have:

24-Apr-1916: Flt Sub-Lieut Herbert Rutter Simms & Flt Sub-Lieut Kevin Robert Furniss, 1 RNAS, Nieuport 12 8904, FF 33E destroyed north-east of Zeebrugge at 14:45/15:45 - Oblt Kurt Faber (Kia) & FlugM Paul Reutter (Kia), SEE I

05-Feb-1917: Capt Geoffrey Maxwell Boumphrey & Capt Frank Findlay, 46 RFC, Nieuport 12 A3274, two-seater out of control east of Ypres at 14:20/15:20 - Vzfw Alfred Ulmer, Jasta 8, Wia [?]

15-Feb-1917: 2nd-Lieut Stuart Harvey Pratt & 2nd-Lieut Geoffrey Bryers, 46 RFC, Nieuport 20 A229, Albatros Scout captured (with 1 RFC) Vlamertinghe at 17:00/18:00 - Ltn Hans von Keudell, Jasta 2, Kia

I have nothing that suggests Pratt made a claim in March 1917.

Graeme

[Knusel]

Hello Graeme,

thanks for your post.
Do you have a citation that confirms that Pratt's total was 6 and not 7 ?

Have a nice weekend,

Michael

[Graeme]

My personal take is that Pratt achieved five victories:

15-Feb-1917: 2nd-Lieut Stuart Harvey Pratt & 2nd-Lieut Geoffrey Bryers, 46 RFC, Nieuport 20 A229, Albatros Scout captured [+ 1 RFC] Vlamertinghe at 17:00/18:00

25-May-1917: Capt Stuart Harvey Pratt, 46 RFC, Pup A7327, Albatros out of control

03-Jun-1917: Capt Stuart Harvey Pratt, 46 RFC, Pup A7327, Albatros Scout out of control Quesnoy at 08:30/09:30

15-Jun-1917: Capt Stuart Harvey Pratt, 46 RFC, Pup A7327, Albatros C out of control ? Ploegsteert at 10:50/11:50

17-Jun-1917: Capt Stuart Harvey Pratt, 46 RFC, Pup A7327, Albatros Scout out of control Lens at 19:30/20:30

The listing on this Forum suggests a victory in March 1917 and another on 5 June 1917.

I have nothing for Pratt in March 1917 and the combat report for 5 June 1917 reads (verbatim):

Capt Pratt had three fights but gun was not satisfactory owing to connecting rod working loose. He attacked one two seater over Wytschaete fired few rounds but had to desist owing to gun. Attacked single seat Albatross over warneton but had to give up al so owing to gun. Attacked third two seater over Armentieres but gun was still poor and no result was observed. H.A. retired.

The report gives the names of the nine pilots involved but no serial numbers.

I am tempted to believe that the 5 June 'claim' is actually a mis-dated duplicate of the 3 June claim.

Graeme

[Knusel]

Good morning Graeme,

oh no, that means that in contrast to the info given in the book of Norman Franks Stuart Pratt wasn't a Sopwith Pup ace.
"Air Aces of the 1914-1918 War" by Robertson doesn't list Pratt at all as an ace.
Do you have a book that indicates his score as 5 ?

Cheers,

Michael

[Graeme]

Hello Michael,

Sorry to rain on your parade, but my own digging about reveals only four victories on the Sopwith Pup and one more on the Nieuport 20.

The old Harleyford book was good, but could be wildly inaccurate in some respects, so while it brought a lot of 'new' names into general awareness, the supporting details were often incomplete or just plain wrong. However, it did start me off of the path of digging up information on claims, so I thank the authors and publishers for that.

Graeme

[Knusel]

Good evening Graeme,

the Robertson book is one of my favourites, too. I bought my copy in the summer of 1996 in a York book shop that specialized on aviation book only.

Have a nice New Year's Eve,

Michael

[Knusel]

...I've found a photo of Mr Pratt:
https://livesofthefirstworldwar.iwm....estory/3582560