Halberstadt A.II

[airplane176]

Hello all,

Does anyone have any pictures or serials of the Halberstadt A.II? I have seen numerous sources that say these are wood fuselage license-built versions of the Fokker M.8/A.II with a side entry opening, but have never seen such a photo. Thank you.

Roger

[richard B]

I hope this could help : more , I don't know …

[airplane176]

Richard,

Thank you for posting this information. What source is this from? It quotes A.1598/14 as a serial, but several sources show only 294 A-types purchased in 1914, with the highest serial that I have as 312/14. The same photo is in Wagner's German Combat Planes captioned as a Fokker M.8.

Roger

[josef scott]

Hallo Roger & Richard,

The Halberstadt A.II was a license-built version of the Fokker A.I and is very difficult to distinguish from the original. I've never come across them referred to as "wooden-built" or having a side entry and neither is accurate. Most sources I've read state that they lacked the windshields mounted on the sides of the Fokker A.I, but this is also a fallacy. That arméenummer is spurious as well, for the exact reason you've stated. I am as yet unaware of any known serials for the Halbs. They were steel-framed and covered in fabric, as per Fokker construction. Generally-speaking, the most reliable way of identifying them is that most (but not all) had the stirrup for mounting the aircraft replaced with a recessed step above the bottom longeron. Many also had an odd opening installed on the starboard fuselage side, which may have been to afford better access to the drain on the rear fuel tank. The filler for this tank was set further to starboard as well.

The photo Richard posted is indeed a Halb A.II, although the port side-panel on the nose has been removed, presumably for maintenance. The diagram is rather inaccurate. It lacks the side cockpit window beneath the wing, and the control cables for the elevator were not arranged as illustrated — they also followed the standard Fokker system used on all Eindeckers.

There are several good photos of the Halb A.II in *ahem* Fokker Eindecker Compendium Vol.1 from Albatros Productions.

[Tork1945]

Originally Posted by airplane176

Richard,

Thank you for posting this information. What source is this from? It quotes A.1598/14 as a serial, but several sources show only 294 A-types purchased in 1914, with the highest serial that I have as 312/14. The same photo is in Wagner's German Combat Planes captioned as a Fokker M.8.

Roger

Obviously archive material has been lost, but Some pictures still exist and miraculously come along.

This machine sports 939.14.

Foto PK Flieger FLUGZEUG Doppeldecker Kennung 939.14 Posen 1915 SEHR SELTEN | eBay

Although there is no evidence that German serials were allotted in order this one is a really high number. There is always the possibility that the serial is wrongly painted on as happened sometimes.

Tork1945

[musec]

Hi Tork,

I believe what Roger meant is that A type serial numbers for 1914 run only to A 312/14. B ype numbers according to Roger's site at http://aircraft.list-of-domains.org/...rmySerials.pdf run to B.1220/14 and record the machine in your link as a LVG B.I.

Regards,

Clint

[richard B]

Originally Posted by airplane176

Richard,

What source is this from?

Roger

Sorry , I don't know : I have only a copy from a friend on the WW net ...

[Aquilius]

Originally Posted by airplane176

What source is this from?

Hey Friends,

this data sheet is to find with


This book was printed in 1992, discussing the restauration process of the Halb. CL.IV in co-operation with the Berlin "Museum f. Verkehr und Technik" - today "Deutsches Technikmuseum Berlin" whis is also quoted as source of the relevant picture.

It does show a Halberstadt built machine. And as Josef told already, the main difference to recognise at first hand was the step-hole instead of a hanging stirrup with the Fokker's.
I have also noted those machines were delivered without cellon covers in these side windows.
And of course they had a steel tube body along the lines of their pattern.

Of the dubious serial I don't know more. I think I have mentioned that before. For this part, the presentation of other Halberstadt products within that book, mainly Pete Grosz contributed such data - serials and photographs. Just I have the impression that originates from a typo in reviewed documents. Nowadays it might not be determined whoever was responsible for.

Cheers

Aquilius

[airplane176]

Thank you all for your information.

One of the "Wooden fuselage" sources is here: Fokker A-1 (M-8) I am unable to find another right now. They may all be copying each other's incorrect information. It also states the Halberstadt internal designation as "F14". I believe Bruno Lange also lists a possible Halberstadt "E14" as a license-built Fokker M.8/A.I. I do not have a copy of his book.

Josef, I hoped that you would chime in. I hope to purchase copies of both your highly-recommended Fokker books as soon as my financial position improves.

Tork, Clint is correct in that I meant only the 1914 A-type serials, The 1914 B-type list continues to at least 1200 and I do have B.939/14 as an LVG.

Aquilius, Thank you for the name of the reference. I will be looking over your new serial information and updating my list. I always appreciate it.

Thank you all again,

Roger