Mysterious German aircraft (in China?)

[JunkersK47]

Gentlemen,



Please have a look at this images and let me know what you think.

1) It is said to have been taken by George Meacham of the USMC in Shanghai and comes with other photos clearly taken in China. What about the personnel - are they USMC?

2) What type of aircraft is it?

3) Can anything be said about the insignia on the fuselage.

4) IF it is one of the mysterious German aircraft imported to Shanghai in 1922 (See my book "A History of Chinese Aviation", pages 41-43), why does it carry the Iron Cross and not the 1918 type German marking?

Any thoughts and ideas, please.

Lennart Andersson

[kristjanr]

No idea what type it is, the tail looks vaguely like a De Havilland of some sort. The insignia is decidedly non standard and looks like the type of insignia used on German aircraft in the 1914 period before these things were standardized. Once that happened German national insignia were quite consistent and they looked nothing like this. The Germans are big sticklers for accuracy in matters of standardization. My guess is this is not a German aircraft, perhaps it is a sporting plane that was rigged up with iron crosses for some publicity event after the war?

[Tork1945]

Interesting picture. I am not qualified to mention anything on the personnel, but the scarcely visible machine looks like a "Germanized" style 1920's machine. As already given by Mr. Kristjanr the German markings are really not authentic and the visible skull painting with bones underneath is very unauthentic. Just visible is a radiator hanging before the top wing.

Given the construction in the background, this might be a sort of festive occasion in Shanghai to commemorate the end of WW1 (speculative of course) sometime in the 1920's.

Heavy US military involvement is quoted in your book I think by memory. No need to check as you wrote that book yourself - many thanks for writing such a very extensively researched book on the little known Chinese aviation history.

Tork1945

[Ransom E. Olds]

The plane is clearly made up to superficially resemble a Central powers airplane of the Great War period, and the men seem American to me, give or take a tunic or two. I wonder if it isn't connected to some film being made in California. Whatever the circumstances, it is interesting! Ransom

[Kaiser Bill]

I'm with Ransom...it could be "Holly-weird" well after the war ended.

[Rod_Filan]

Originally Posted by Kaiser Bill

...it could be "Holly-weird"

As much as it could explain the "weird" markings, I'm not so quick to accept that. It would seem to me the appearance of a lone US sailor among these Marines (real leathernecks for the most part in this group I assume) is more plausible at Hungjao aerodrome mid-to-late 1920s than in the sticks somewhere out near San Bernadino.



Cheers

[John McKenzie]

Hi ...
I get the impression that the " Basis" of this machine is a Nieuport 27 .
Cobbled together in China . !

John M

[JunkersK47]

Thanks for your input!

I suppose you mean the Nieuport 28, but the wing struts and the black object (radiator??) beneath the upper wing still does not seem to fit.

The uniforms seem to perhaps be US Marine Corps anyhow:



Lennart Andersson

[Jim]

After the war there were endless 'victory celebrations' and perhaps this is from one of them? If it was in Shanghai it is possible that it was a part of the US effort to awe the Chinese and gain political support over the Germans and other countries who were in China trying to do the same thing.

[JohnMacG]

Lennart,
the tail screams 'de Havilland', so I'd take a WAG that it's an early type of Moth, maybe a DH60 type - the time period is too early for a Tiger Moth.