Breguet's Aircraft ID Challenge #803

[Linhawk]

The scoreboard at the end of #802 - Sablatnig SF 8


138.40 Varese2002 ¤¤
106.70 Dave_Kent ¤¤
89.20 Rbailey ¤
38.40 richard B ¤
33.30 Cruze ¤
28.00 Aquilius ¤
27.55 Lodzermensch ¤
23.40 YavorD
22.35 Froggy
16.90 Flamingo
13.80 Rod Filan
11.00 Breguet
10.45 GregE
10.30 Patrick
09.70 Dan-San
09.70 FOKKERJ Feuchtwanger
09.50 matte_kudasai
08.40 JohnMacG
07.70 EdStevens
07.60 trp81
07.10 Colin A. Owers
07.25 Ermeio
06.70 Ampovandak
06.70 Berman
06.10 joegertler
06.00 Eric Goedkoop
05.90 Doc
05.70 AROTH
05.60 ercoupepilot
05.30 Crimso
05.30 Der Grüne Flieger
05.20 Maze
05.20 Gilles
05.10 bshatzer
05.00 Tom L
05.00 sobrien ..........................have to wait 12 hours

04.75 SCMc ........................may start immediately
04.70 dpolglaze
04.40 Ross Moorhouse
04.30 edmondthieffry
04.30 HoHun
04.20 Rufe
04.00 greenknight
04.00 John McKenzie
03.90 Brad
03.00 Catfish
03.00 Linhawk
02.50 Gregoire
02.50 Rexee
02.50 '14-'18aviationcollector
02.30 ckingh5
02.10 Crankcase
02.00 austin08
02.00 Rickenbaron
01.70 Kilian
01.60 airplane176
01.60 sergio_vitalio
01.50 Albatros_Ace
01.30 Cigogne
01.20 Ransom E. Olds
01.00 Cliff
01.00 cubsfan4life
01.00 gregorydquist
01.00 Luf-Rick
01.00 Mike Westorp
01.00 paolomiana
01.00 Peter Zambori
01.00 rammjaeger
01.00 SL DIII
01.00 Tripehound
01.00 albatros1234
00.90 Stig Jarlevik
00.80 Machinbird
00.80 Mad Mac
00.80 tbstreet
00.80 toxisch
00.60 Sreiko
00.50 Martin Irvine
00.40 Vilkata
00.30 albapfalzd30
00.30 Miroslav Pokorny
00.30 Nieuport14
00.20 Paul_J._Fisher

Previous: Aeroplanes 1914 - 1918* -* Breguet's Aircraft Challenge* --

The Rules

1. The thread title must be "Bréguet's Aircraft ID Challenge #......"
2. The score board, link and rules must be copied to the beginning of each thread, so that we know where we are. The score board and the correct answer to the challenge must also be placed at end of each thread.
3. The completed aircraft must have been either; designed, built or have left the ground during the '14-'18 period and be identifiable by the poster.
4. The photo must show the whole aircraft - from whatever angle, or at least 2 views of a 3 view drawing (photo by preference).
5. Challenges which depict a machine already earlier presented are disqualified (always check the list at Aeroplanes 1914 - 1918* -* Breguet's -Aircraft Challenge* -- when in doubt !).
6. If there is any doubt as to the eligibility of an aircraft for the challenge details should be PM'd to Breguet BEFORE the aircraft is submitted.
7. Once someone has got 5 correct answers under their belt they become an ACE. Once they become an ACE they must wait 12hrs after the posting of the new challenge before they can post an answer.
8. To be eligible for correct ID an answer must include at least one characteristic of the aircraft that helped in its identification.
9. The first person to ID the challenge correctly gets to post the next challenge. If this can not be done for any reason Breguet himself will post the next challenge.
10. If an ace gives the correct answer too early, the challenge is over, he gets no point but has to post the next one. In lieu of the fact that the "novices" have in effect been "cheated" of their "exclusive" time that next post should be a relatively easy one. Anyone repeating the correct answer at the right time gets neither a point nor the right to post the next challenge.
11. The final arbiter in relation to questions about the rules is BREGUET

My last entry was an aircraft I found aesthetically pleasing. This one not so much.

[Linhawk]

Uh oh, it looks like this plane has been done before. I could have sworn it wasn't on the list when I checked earlier.

This challenge is on hold until I find and upload a suitable replacement. Hopefully that will be before I go to sleep.

[Linhawk]

All right, here's the replacement aircraft. I'm not going to be too picky about the exact designation, as long as you show me you know what particular plane this is.

[Dave_Kent]

This is the “Blue Bird” monoplane designed by Harold Kentner (Kentner-Moisant), based on the Morane-Saulnier type “G”. Kentner adjusted the measurements to better fit North American manufacturing practices, using standard lengths to simplify construction. This resulted in a slightly smaller machine. It was also known as the Kentner Military Morane Monoplane.

Mexican Aviation History

Dave

[Linhawk]

The official name of the aircraft appears to be the Morane-Kantner Military Monoplane, but it was nicknamed the "Blue Bird", and the name of Moisant was often attached to it: Moisant "Blue Bird", Kantner-Moisant "Blue Bird", Moisant Military Scout. I would have accepted the official designation or any answer that contains "Kantner" or "Moisant" plus the nickname "Blue Bird". Given these criteria, the point goes to Dave_Kent. Of course, it didn't hurt that you linked to the exact site where I found the photograph!

Harold D. Kantner received flight instruction at the Moisant aviation school on Long Island in 1910, where he in turn became an instructor, as well as an aircraft designer and test pilot. During the winter of 1912-13 he designed and built the Morane-Kantner Military Monoplane, a modification of the Morane Saulnier "G". The aircraft was destroyed in the Hempstead Trials on December 18, 1913, but that didn't prevent Kantner/Moisant from building more of them, particularly when Pancho Villa and Venustiano Carranza showed interest in acquiring aircraft for use in the Mexican Revolution.

The first "Blue Bird" arrived in Mexico in February of 1914. Two more arrived in May. Following Carranza's triumphal entry into Mexico City on August 20, 1914, he ordered the aircraft to be moved to the capital, where they formed the Flotilla Aérea Constitucionalista. After Villa turned against Carranza, the aircraft were used to bomb the rebel forces in December of 1914. One of the aircraft was destroyed during fighting in the spring of 1915, while another, after being badly damaged, was converted into a biplane. The other aircraft survived the hostilities, which ended in 1917, intact.

Another "Blue Bird" is said to have crashed in Guatemala City in 1916 as the city's elevation (5000 ft) is above the aircraft's ceiling (3600 ft). The pilot of the plane was named Wilson Minerly. However, a very similar story is told of a two-seater Taube which was unable to get off the ground. I think the most likely possibility is that there was a "Blue Bird" that crashed in an unrelated accident, and somehow the two stories were combined, particularly if the two aircraft were flown by the same pilot.

By the way, the first photograph I posted is the De Bruyère C1, which was the subject of challenge #346.


The scoreboard at the end of #803 - Morane-Kantner Military Monoplane


138.40 Varese2002 ¤¤
107.70 Dave_Kent ¤¤
89.20 Rbailey ¤
38.40 richard B ¤
33.30 Cruze ¤
28.00 Aquilius ¤
27.55 Lodzermensch ¤
23.40 YavorD
22.35 Froggy
16.90 Flamingo
13.80 Rod Filan
11.00 Breguet
10.45 GregE
10.30 Patrick
09.70 Dan-San
09.70 FOKKERJ Feuchtwanger
09.50 matte_kudasai
08.40 JohnMacG
07.70 EdStevens
07.60 trp81
07.10 Colin A. Owers
07.25 Ermeio
06.70 Ampovandak
06.70 Berman
06.10 joegertler
06.00 Eric Goedkoop
05.90 Doc
05.70 AROTH
05.60 ercoupepilot
05.30 Crimso
05.30 Der Grüne Flieger
05.20 Maze
05.20 Gilles
05.10 bshatzer
05.00 Tom L
05.00 sobrien ..........................have to wait 12 hours

04.75 SCMc :goggles; ........................ may start immediately
04.70 dpolglaze
04.40 Ross Moorhouse
04.30 edmondthieffry
04.30 HoHun
04.20 Rufe
04.00 greenknight
04.00 John McKenzie
03.90 Brad
03.00 Catfish
03.00 Linhawk
02.50 Gregoire
02.50 Rexee
02.50 '14-'18aviationcollector
02.30 ckingh5
02.10 Crankcase
02.00 austin08
02.00 Rickenbaron
01.70 Kilian
01.60 airplane176
01.60 sergio_vitalio
01.50 Albatros_Ace
01.30 Cigogne
01.20 Ransom E. Olds
01.00 Cliff
01.00 cubsfan4life
01.00 gregorydquist
01.00 Luf-Rick
01.00 Mike Westorp
01.00 paolomiana
01.00 Peter Zambori
01.00 rammjaeger
01.00 SL DIII
01.00 Tripehound
01.00 albatros1234
00.90 Stig Jarlevik
00.80 Machinbird
00.80 Mad Mac
00.80 tbstreet
00.80 toxisch
00.60 Sreiko
00.50 Martin Irvine
00.40 Vilkata
00.30 albapfalzd30
00.30 Miroslav Pokorny
00.30 Nieuport14
00.20 Paul_J._Fisher

[Linhawk]

On second thought, according to this account, Minerly made a final attempt to force the Taube to fly, and was partly successful, but was unable to land on the airfield as the spectators had crowded onto it, and he crash-landed in a cornfield instead. After that he was in the hospital for two months. I'm now inclined to see the Blue Bird and Taube stories as essentially the same and mutually exclusive, and I'm leaning towards the aircraft being a Taube. I'm not sure why it has been identified as a Blue Bird, but the Moisant school of aviation had a significant influence on early Guatemalan aviation, so it's possible a Blue Bird made its way to Guatemala at some point.