WW1 Aero Snippet in ABC "Talking Heads" TV Show

Barry Hickson · 1 July 2010, 05:02 PM

G'day All!
I was lucky to see the June 28th TV show Talking Heads which featured F.A.O. (Tony) Gaze the Aussie WW2 Spitfire pilot & Racing Driver who is now 91 & still quite sharp.
During the interview he related a story about his father (Irvine) who flew with the RFC during WW1. Seems Irvine was Shot or Forced down & captured by perhaps JG1 as he was subently taken to the German Aerodromes Mess where he was questioned on the White Medal Ribbon he wore.
The Medal had been awarded for his service in the Shakleton Antartic Expedition & the Germans then threw a party & had him recount his adventures before he was taken to a prison camp. Tony mentioned that Goring was very "sullen" during this event.
Would be interesting if anyone on the Forum or perhaps Peter Killduff during his Goring research has any more details on this matter.

Graeme · 1 July 2010, 11:40 PM

Hi Barry

Gaze was a pilot in No 48 Squadron and was shot down in F2b E2583 on 4 November 1918 with his observer, 2nd Lt C W Newstead.

The squadron lost three Bristols during a combat over Lessines at 15:15 with all six crewmen being taken prisoner. Pilots of Jasta 27 claimed five victories, Ltn d R Hermann Frommherz claiming two Bristols, Ltn d R Wilhelm Neuenhofen claiming two unidentified aircraft and the other might have been claimed by Sgt Willy Kahle.

Graeme

Gregvan · 2 July 2010, 05:29 PM

Great information from both of you!!

So, Irvin Gaze would have met Goering during his tenure as Jasta 27 commander. at Bavichove. Though he did not score against the Bristols of 48 Squadron on 4 November, Goering did successfully claim a victory only three days later. However, none of the 32 Squadron D.H.5's that he tangled with that day were actually shot down.

Goering's "sullen" disposition during the party for Gaze might have been due to "a certain exhaustion" he stated he felt in a message he wrote on 1 November. This was probably due to his extensive frontline flying and his rheumatoid arthritis aggravated by the recent cold and wet weather. This last info comes from Peter Kilduff's excellent new book on Goering.

Barry Hickson · 2 July 2010, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregvan

Great information from both of you!!

So, Irvin Gaze would have met Goering during his tenure as Jasta 27 commander. at Bavichove. Though he did not score against the Bristols of 48 Squadron on 4 November, Goering did successfully claim a victory only three days later. However, none of the 32 Squadron D.H.5's that he tangled with that day were actually shot down.

Goering's "sullen" disposition during the party for Gaze might have been due to "a certain exhaustion" he stated he felt in a message he wrote on 1 November. This was probably due to his extensive frontline flying and his rheumatoid arthritis aggravated by the recent cold and wet weather. This last info comes from Peter Kilduff's excellent new book on Goering.

Thanks Greg! Iam waiting for my copy of the Goering Book which I preordered from Amazon.

Watch out for my post to come shortly on some Margin Notes & Bookplate I found in a book on AFC men & Aircraft I just got 2nd hand through Ardvaak Books in WI USA.

Germanophile-1 · 3 July 2010, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry Hickson

During the interview he related a story about his father (Irvine) who flew with the RFC during WW1. Seems Irvine was Shot or Forced down & captured by perhaps JG1 as he was subently taken to the German Aerodromes Mess where he was questioned on the White Medal Ribbon he wore.
The Medal had been awarded for his service in the Shackleton Antarctic Expedition & the Germans then threw a party & had him recount his adventures before he was taken to a prison camp. Tony mentioned that Göring was very "sullen" during this event.
Would be interesting if anyone on the Forum or perhaps Peter Kilduff during his Göring research has any more details on this matter.

Thanks, Barry, for that interesting tidbit.

Alas, I did not find mention of it amongst Göring's writings and stories he related to others.

On a related matter, when I was in the U.S. Navy, I took part in "Operation Deep Freeze '62," the U.S. logistical effort to support civilian scientific research in Antarctica. In "about" November 1961, I visited the supply "hut" that Ernest Shackleton set up at Cape Royds on Ross Island just off the Antarctic coast.

So, I guess you could say that trip put me "physically" closer to Shackleton than I ever got to Göring (although I did handle various personal papers of Göring's).

I love the story about Shackleton.

Peter

Gregvan · 3 July 2010, 10:23 AM

Gee, this just keeps getting better and better!

I imagine you know, Barry, that the great Australian photographer Frank Hurley is the one who recorded the Shackleton expedition in so many incredible still photos and motion picture film. I've read of (and seen in the docudrama movie starring Kenneth Branagh as Shackleton) the heartbreaking scene where Hurely has to choose which of his glass plate negs he gets to save and which he has to destroy in order to save weight on the long expedition out...

Anyway, after his return Hurley joined the Australian Imperial Force as an official photgrapher. As such, he was responsible for some of the best official photos of Aussie airmen and aircraft, including (I believe) those incredible color images of No. 1 Squadron in Palestine. What a life he had!! Also served as an official photographer in WW II.

I just love finding these connections between historic people...kind of like six degrees of separation.

Barry Hickson · 3 July 2010, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Germanophile-1

Thanks, Barry, for that interesting tidbit.

Alas, I did not find mention of it amongst Göring's writings and stories he related to others.

On a related matter, when I was in the U.S. Navy, I took part in "Operation Deep Freeze '62," the U.S. logistical effort to support civilian scientific research in Antarctica. In "about" November 1961, I visited the supply "hut" that Ernest Shackleton set up at Cape Royds on Ross Island just off the Antarctic coast.

So, I guess you could say that trip put me "physically" closer to Shackleton than I ever got to Göring (although I did handle various personal papers of Göring's).

I love the story about Shackleton.

Peter

G'day Peter! That must have been a most interesting experience!
Amazing how much "Old" stuff is still around down there.
In the ABC show they showed clips of pics from the Antartic & mentioned that Shakletons fellows found Scotts Camp.

Barry Hickson · 3 July 2010, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregvan

Gee, this just keeps getting better and better!

I imagine you know, Barry, that the great Australian photographer Frank Hurley is the one who recorded the Shackleton expedition in so many incredible still photos and motion picture film. I've read of (and seen in the docudrama movie starring Kenneth Branagh as Shackleton) the heartbreaking scene where Hurely has to choose which of his glass plate negs he gets to save and which he has to destroy in order to save weight on the long expedition out...

Anyway, after his return Hurley joined the Australian Imperial Force as an official photgrapher. As such, he was responsible for some of the best official photos of Aussie airmen and aircraft, including (I believe) those incredible color images of No. 1 Squadron in Palestine. What a life he had!! Also served as an official photographer in WW II.

I just love finding these connections between historic people...kind of like six degrees of separation.

Hi Greg! Yes I have seen many of Hurley's works.Certainly led an adventurous life. He also did some fantastic series of colour shots of well known landmarks in our Blue Mountains National Parks. A bit of an Ansel Adams as well.

The Tony Gaze TV interview show actually used some of Hurleys movies from that Expedition.

'14-'18aviationcollector · 3 July 2010, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregvan

Gee, this just keeps getting better and better!

I imagine you know, Barry, that the great Australian photographer Frank Hurley is the one who recorded the Shackleton expedition in so many incredible still photos and motion picture film. I've read of (and seen in the docudrama movie starring Kenneth Branagh as Shackleton) the heartbreaking scene where Hurely has to choose which of his glass plate negs he gets to save and which he has to destroy in order to save weight on the long expedition out...

Anyway, after his return Hurley joined the Australian Imperial Force as an official photgrapher. As such, he was responsible for some of the best official photos of Aussie airmen and aircraft, including (I believe) those incredible color images of No. 1 Squadron in Palestine. What a life he had!! Also served as an official photographer in WW II.

I just love finding these connections between historic people...kind of like six degrees of separation.

Hi Greg,

Yes you are right. Frank Hurley was the photographer who recorded the still and movie images during the Shackelton expedition, took the colour photographs of No.1 Squadron AFC in Palestine and was an Official Photographer during the Second World War as well - (unless I am confusing him with Damian Parer, the son of Ray Parer, who flew the DH9 I helped to restore from England to Australia in 1919 / 1920). I might be able to find some more information about him but these days of course most of us have the great resources of the internet freely available to us, so any one of us could look him up.

I don't know if any of you know this, but Frank Hurley was supposed to take more colour photographs of aeroplanes on other fronts, particularly (or maybe it was only) the Western Front, but these efforts were cancelled on more than one occasion due to bad weather. I am sure there would have been a lot of bad weather on the Western Front, and I have always thought what a shame it is that Frank did not take any colour photographs of other Squadrons.

Regards,

David.

Gregvan · 3 July 2010, 09:49 PM

David,

You just broke my heart! Wow, what if Hurley had succeeded in wandering around the Western Front taking color photos of various squadrons!

Gee, the only thing that could have been better would be if he & his equipment had been captured by the Germans, and they knew a good thing and took him around to photograph THEIR Jagdstaffeln...now THAT would be something.