Australian originals being restored

[Breguet]

For those who mightn't have caught up with this news:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...29/2176491.htm

['14-'18aviationcollector]

Thanks for posting this!

Well, the Albatros certainly does look fantastic! I saw this on the news on TV, and the photo in the article you gave the link to is the same as what I saw on TV - the underside of the top wing. I believe the lozenge fabric is the same as the lozenge which was used for the restoration of the NASM's Albatros D.Va, so it's probably too bright (at least they are the reports I have heard), but I have to say it does look great in the photo attached to the article you supplied the link to. The original fabric had very bright colours, but they were applied in a very patchy manner - they were not always solid, and there was some degree of inconsistency in the colour, mostly due to varying saturation as the dyes were applied. The only colourn I have noted which actually seems to change shade as the saturation varies is the brown on the top surface, which I observed change colour from a medium brown to a much lighter version, almost yellow. These different colours were on the same piece of fabric! Presumably the roller ran out of colour as was rolling across the fabric. The colour changed dramatically in the space of two revolutions, or at least two repetitions of the pattern.

My only comment about the current restoration work is that I offered my extensive research on the Albatros and Pfalz in particular, and it was refused. The situation now is one I wanted to avoid. I have an agreement to publish this work in an AWM magazine, but my research work will be too late for the currrent restoration work, which is being carried out at the moment. The AWM, or at least some of their staff, are not as helpful as they could be. I was not allowed access to the wings before they were covered. I was allowed access on one occasion, but there was not time to study the wings on this occasion. I have been told that I will probably be allowed further access when my research work is published, but it will be too late to study the wings properly. Bob Waugh had similar difficulties with the same staff member for a number of years, and now that he has stopped carrying out very much research for a number of years, his work is supposedly held in very high regard.

I would like some feedback. I believe that not only should any museum carrying out restoration work go to every length possible to get such details as the fuselage correct, but they should do so with the fabric as well. It is my belief that lozenge in particular should be placed as closely as possible to the way it was placed originally. I noticed many irregularities and interesting little details that would have made the aeroplanes look a lot more authentic, and in fact they would have been a lot more authentic. For example, I noticed on the Pfalz that generally the pattern alternates, but on one panel, it was placed the same way as the panel adjoining it, almost certainly by mistake or through carelessness. There are many other irregularities, such as the fabric being pulled at awkward angles. The fabric really was applied reasonably roughly in some ways, and there were stencils of course. As previously mentioned, the colour saturation was also very inconsistent. Should all of these details be replicated? I believe they should, and I believe that individual aeroplanes can be identified in some or many cases, by the way the lozenge and / or other markings were applied on each particular aeroplane. I intend to produce some art work relating to this subject for as many aeroplanes as I can find decent information for. The first will be the AWM's Pfalz, closely followed by the AWM's Albatros D.Va.

Who agrees with me, and who thinks my intended work goes into too much detail?

[Chambersaviator]

Originally Posted by '14-'18aviationcollector

Thanks for posting this!
Who agrees with me, and who thinks my intended work goes into too much detail?

I totally agree with you. I don't think there is any such thing as going into to much detail. Accuracy is a wonderful thing, though at times hard to attain.

[Der Grüne Flieger]

Breguet,

Thanks for the post, and the link. Does anyone know of this French aircraft expert Alain Vallet? Is he present on this forum??

David,

I think it is unfortunate that some people feel the need to be road blocks of knowledge instead facilitators. Why would they chose to ignore your research? Who knows, but it reflects very poorly on them.

The other thing that really pisses me off is the indifference that most museum staff show to someone who wants a bit more time or would like to take closeup pictures of a subject a/c. If you take them out of their normal routine, everything becomes a problem.

The only thing I can say is bite your tongue and work as hard to make friends of the staff as you do on your research.

Phil

[Dan_San_Abbott]

Breguet;
Some time ago, I also offered my help to get the finish of this valuable relic finished properly. If the wings are covered with polygon printed fabric, it will be wrong. The only thing covered with five color printed fabrioc was the right aileron. Colin, what were you telling me about the AWM staff and Bob Waugh. The data I have is from Bob Waugh. Another group that could not do it correctly. The wings had a painted camouflage, except for the right aileron. What did they do to the fuselage and empennage? did they screw that up? Does AWM stand for "*******s with museum?" I hope I am wrong.
I think I know how you feel '14-'18.
Grey skies,
Dan-San

[Breguet]

I heard a rumour that some of the original covering has been located and so a very accurate job will be done. 2nd coat of dope to go on soon! Also the staff of the AWM that I've had dealings with are excellent and most helpful. I guess there are bad eggs where ever you go. But just so you know some of them are absolutely as helpful as could be.

[Colin A Owers]

The original Albatros fabric has been located and is being used as the basis for the restoration. The French Memorial Flight personnel came to Australia to show the AWM staff how to apply the fabric as they have the most expertise in applying German losenge fabric today.

The original negatives (glass plates?) were taken from the AWM store and used to print large - about 5 feet long, photographs of the aircraft when displayed at No.3's aerodrome after capture. They detail is tremendous. Every care is being taken to make the restoration as true tot he original as possible - including brown metal nose panels!

The same care is being taken with the Pfalz D.XII. I have given the Memorial all my data on the D.XII. The problem is that at the time of the earlier restoration of the D.XII no one seems to have taken colour slides or samples of the fuselage. Bob Waugh's research was done in the Aeroplane Hall under bad light conditions. I still contend that what Bob recorded was what was present at that time. We have no way of knowing what happened in the intervening years. The paint was flaking off at the time when Bob was there and unfortunately, Bob's samples were lost. The brown of the nose panels was colour matched by me at the time I did the Windsock article.

The AWM is doing all it can to make these two as authentic as it is possible given the data available.

If I could work out how to post photos I could show some of the work.

Colin A Owers

[Ross_Moorhouse]

This is such good news. Lets hope when they go on dispaly they will be in some good lighting. Not like most of the displays.

[Breguet]

Bright ligths are always a problem as they deteriorate things far more quickly. This display should be great. It will also have with it a movie display of a WW1combat. Prepared, rumour has it, by a certain WW1 loving movie director.

[Ross_Moorhouse]

Originally Posted by Breguet

Bright ligths are always a problem as they deteriorate things far more quickly. This display should be great. It will also have with it a movie display of a WW1combat. Prepared, rumour has it, by a certain WW1 loving movie director.

Who like big apes on buildings I bet.....