Organization of the RFC

3 January 2003, 08:37 AM

I'm new to your group, although I have read a number of your threads, and find them very interesting reading, especially recommendations on books. *Which brings me to my topic of interest. *My granddad flew as an observer in 16 Sqdrn of the RFC between June 1917 and January 1918. *I would like to find out the organizational structure of the RFC so as to figure out how 16 Squadron fit into the RFC, especially during the latter half of 1917. *Is there a book or books on, admittedly, a rather dry subject? *Or perhaps, one of you folks know just how my granddad's squadron fit into the bigger organization picture that was the RFC. *Granddad mentioned that members of his squadron would play rugby with 40 Squadron, 8 Naval, Wing Headquarters and Canadian Headquarters. *Were they all formally organized together at the time? *

I have a second question as to where I could find 16 Squadron's field at Camblain L'Abbe, a little village southeast of Bruay. *Mike O'Connor's books don't cover 16 at Camblain L'Abbe, although his Ypres book does discuss 16 Squadron in 1916 at Merville Aerodrome. *In 1917, they moved to Camblain L'Abbe. *Someday, I'd like to go to France and find his airfield he flew from. *Thanks for any info or leads on both subjects. *Great website!!

stephen · 3 January 2003, 09:53 AM

re8fan;

I've been to France many times on such missions, and I promise you that the French locals will know precisely where to find the airfield you are looking for. On a number of occasions I've had to blindly walk up to a door and knock, asking the resident where such and such an airfield or monument was located. Invariably, I get passed around to two or three different people and end up being personally escorted there by some aging French person who gives me the entire story of how their great uncle help install the telephone wiring at this field in 1916, yadda yadda.

No matter how small the field or remote the monument, ask around... somebody will know.

alex_revell · 5 January 2003, 01:30 AM

Your grandad would have served with 16 sqdn when they were stationed at Camblain-l'Abbe. They moved there from Bruay (Aug 1916) on 25th May 1917 and stayed until moving to La Brayelle on 21 Oct 1918. They didn't move about a lot, it seems! The sqdn flew BE2g and fs until May 1917 when they were re-equipped with RE8s.
16 Sqdn were a a Corps sqdn, which means they would have been engaged on recco, artillery spotting, etc.
In June 1917 they were with serving under HQ First (Corps)Wing. The CO was Major P C Maltby DSO.
In July they were still with the same Wing but their CO was Major C F A Portal DSO MC.
They were still part of the same Wing for the battle of Cambrai, with the same CO. (Portal)
On 21st March 1918, at the time of the German offensive, they were still in the same Wing, Portal was still Co and they had two Bristol Fighters on charge in addition to their RE8s
In August 1918 they were still in the same Wing but had moved to V111 Corps and were commanded by Major A W C V Parr
At the end of the war they were stationed at Auchy, in the same Corps.
There are more details -formation etc - in WITA Vol 2. If you want more I will look it out for you.

wingstrutdotcom · 5 January 2003, 11:24 AM

I have a profile of one of their RE8 from 1917 on my site http://wingstrut.com/re_8.htm.

Do you have any photos of any of the planes he was associated with, serial #'s, markings?

5 January 2003, 03:38 PM

Alex,
Thanks for the information, Granddad mentioned that he really admired Portal, said he was a marvelous commander. I believe that Hugh Dowding (of Battle of Britain fame) was also assigned to 16 Squadron, but I don't know when. Excuse me for my ignorance, but what is WITA? If you have any further information, that would be great. Were there other squadrons (I presume recon. squadrons) in the Corps Wing? In trying to figure out the RFC structure, it appears that Corps Wings were recon. and artillery spotting, and Army Wings were the fighters. Is that correct? I guess even though 40 Squadron and 8 Naval were nearby at Bruay, they were not organizationally attached to the same Wing as 16.
Again thanks Alex for doing some research on this for me.

Wingstrutdomcom - Yeah, as a matter of fact I do have some old photos of him and his aircraft. Back in 1974, I wrote up his memoirs in the Cross and Cockade Journal, Winter issue. All the photos of his aircraft or at least photos that I have from his collection in shown in that issue. Your website profile shows pretty much how the RE8s looked, with 2 white strips, one on either side of the cockade. I don't have these photos scanned to send, so hopefully you have access to the C&C Journal, that show his pictures. Thanks for your interest.

euking · 6 January 2003, 10:06 AM

I live in the W suburbs of Paris and often travel North, either to the Somme or Arras where friends live. Camblain-L'Abbé is in between Bruay and Arras, next time I am in the area I'll ask around for the location of the field... Each community has a mairie, town-hall , where records are kept, someone is sure to know.

Rick · 6 January 2003, 10:48 AM

euking,

And, it helps that you are obviously fluent in French

. R.

8 January 2003, 07:55 PM

euking,
I really want to thank you for offering to do a little research on my behalf. *If you can find Camblain L'Abbe and ask around, that would be great!! *

*If it is at all possible to try to get a map, or if you could sketch a map if you go to the site that would help a great deal. *
I have no immediate plans to travel to France, would love to, but I'm aways away (California), so that type of trip will have to wait. *But someday, just to go to the spot, knowing that this is where he flew from in those old RE-8s,.....well it would mean a great deal to me,....and to my kids. *Thanks again for offering your help. *If you would care to correspond directly by e-mail, let me know, I'll give you my e-mail address. *
RE8fan.

euking · 9 January 2003, 02:36 AM

Sure, I've been living in and out of France and Spain since 1986. War history is an obvious one in this country, 14-18, 39-45, have left their mark on the landscape and the people.

I'll check out the site for you and get a map and take pictures of anything that seems a genuine site. It is a short drive outside Arras where friend live.

My email should be in my profile.

euking · 29 December 2003, 02:56 PM

I finally got to the airfield site at Camblain l'Abbé today in the region of Arras, France ;just as Steve had said, somebody, actually the local mayor, was prepared to take me right to the site so that I could take some pictures; Today there are no signs of anything there that could tell you that the field was a former WW1 aerodrome.

Unfortunately it seems that re8fan has is no longer at the email address I had . Anyone in touch with re8fan who is in California?

euking