Greven's Fokker D.VII

StephenLawson · 30 August 2006, 11:24 PM

Greetings all; Mofo wrote me in a PM asking a question that might the answer benefit others here.

"Stephen,
I'm doing Greven's D.VII with Eduard's kit. I note that it should have a BMW engine (which the instructions don't point out), but should it have the Axial or Heine prop, AND, as it is the BMW engine, should I be using the 'normal', or the quick release prop? Unfortunately, all the images I've seen of the airframe, have the prop removed!
Cheers for now: Mike"

For Eduard kit #8132 Schwerin built Fokker D.VII see pages 16 -17; Eduard has mistakenly replaced the Roman numerals of II with arabic numbers of 11 for identifying what should be Jagdgeschwader II of which Jasta 12 was a component. The serial number of Ltn. Des. Res. Alfred Greven's Schwerin machine is unconfirmed. A four victory pilot had the same blue fuselage / white lightning bolt scheme painted on several of his mounts. Known to have a BMW engine the guns should be raised slightly. Ltn. Greven probably flew this Schwerin mount at the same time as an identically marked late Fok. D. VII OAW.

The Axial prop on the Eduard kit above (with or without the Rupp prop release cone) is incorrect. There are four propellers of two types offered by the kit. Axial (PP B 16 ) and Heine (PP B 17) and note that Eduard has not referenced the right application to the profile provide in the kit decals. The problem is that the Heine propellers (PP B 17) are far too short for inline six cylinder engines and should be closer in length to the Axial (PP B 16) types provided. Two of the four kit propellers with the cones on the bosses are quick release items seen on some BMW engine variants only. It is the pitch and length of a propeller that determines the engine application. The paddle profile was the company hallmark.

The Rupp quick release propeller hub was used on the airframes with the BMW IIIa engine. With the BMWIIIa engine Fokker used the 2820mm diameter Heine with the Rupp hub.

drIace · 1 September 2006, 08:49 AM

Another nice job STEPHEN ! I wouldn't worry too much about the BMW engine, guns being higher--sounds like AMS is creeping into you work. modeling is supposed to fun. These anal exams do not add anything to enjoyment of the hobby.

Mofo · 1 September 2006, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StephenLawson;287501[COLOR="DarkRed"

The Axial prop on the Eduard kit above (with or without the Rupp prop release cone) is incorrect.

The Rupp quick release propeller hub was used on the airframes with the BMW IIIa engine. With the BMWIIIa engine Fokker used the 2820mm diameter Heine with the Rupp hub.
[/COLOR]

I'm confused.

So, should I use the Axial, or the Heine prop? I know the Heine is inaccurate; if I need to use it, I'll correct the length. I know what the four props in the kit represent. I just don't know whether I should be using the Axial, or the Heine.

I gather the engine was a BMW III, not a IIIa, which means the quick release hub is out. So that narrows my choices down to two.

Or I guess I could just go with Loffler's mount, instead, and save myself the hassle...

Quote:

I wouldn't worry too much about the BMW engine, guns being higher--sounds like AMS is creeping into you work. modeling is supposed to fun. These anal exams do not add anything to enjoyment of the hobby.

Maybe not for you, but they do for some. If it weren't for AMS, I wouldn't bother adding trigger cables to the control stick:

Or added a gun barrel that will never be seen inside the jacket:

I enjoy getting the details right. It adds to my enjoyment.

StephenLawson · 2 September 2006, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drIace

Another nice job STEPHEN ! I wouldn't worry too much about the BMW engine, guns being higher--sounds like AMS is creeping into you work. modeling is supposed to fun. These anal exams do not add anything to enjoyment of the hobby.

Cant take credit for this one Ed this build was done by on of Eduard's own modelers under contract. It was found on their website and is in a series of images on the subject of kit # 8133.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mofo

I'm confused.

So, should I use the Axial, or the Heine prop? I know the Heine is inaccurate; if I need to use it, I'll correct the length. I know what the four props in the kit represent. I just don't know whether I should be using the Axial, or the Heine....Or I guess I could just go with Loffler's mount, instead, and save myself the hassle...

Sorry Mofo; It is a Schwerin built Fokker D.VII with a BMW IIIa. Use a Heine prop with the Rupp prop hub. As drIace has mentioned the guns did sit higher as well.

drIace · 2 September 2006, 04:04 PM

Hope you all did not misunderstand the AMS comment. Big difference in doing something because you enjoy it and doing it because....

Sort of like entering a contest, if you're only building to win an award and do not, you will be one sorry person to be arround. Building what you like and what you want and enjoying it is... winning an award with one like that is just a second scoop of ice cream on top .

Mofo · 2 September 2006, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StephenLawson

[COLOR="DarkRed"]Sorry Mofo; It is a Schwerin built Fokker D.VII with a BMW IIIa. Use a Heine prop with the Rupp prop hub. As drIace has mentioned the guns did sit higher as well.

Right, now I just have to sort out where to cut and splice the props... Thanks muchly.

StephenLawson · 2 September 2006, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drIace

Hope you all did not misunderstand the AMS comment. Big difference in doing something because you enjoy it and doing it because....

Sort of like entering a contest, if you're only building to win an award and do not, you will be one sorry person to be arround. Building what you like and what you want and enjoying it is... winning an award with one like that is just a second scoop of ice cream on top .

Speak it Ed! yea and amen!

StephenLawson · 2 September 2006, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mofo

Right, now I just have to sort out where to cut and splice the props... Thanks muchly.

You could cut the kit prop but why not try a wooden prop? Check with Copper State Models online. Eric may have a 1/48 scale Heine in stock. Just stipulate its for a Fokker D.VII with an inline BMW. These are beautiful. Done by Martin Digmayer. I even tend to cut my own propellers from doll house marqueting woods. In any event good luck! Model On!

bobs_buckles · 3 September 2006, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drIace

Another nice job STEPHEN ! I wouldn't worry too much about the BMW engine, guns being higher--sounds like AMS is creeping into you work. modeling is supposed to fun. These anal exams do not add anything to enjoyment of the hobby.

BINGO!

Well said that man!

Bob Von Buckle

Ross_Moorhouse · 3 September 2006, 04:09 PM

Wooden Props from Copper State http://www.amug.org/~copperst/props.html

Quote:

Hand-Carved Wooden Props

Copper State Models is proud to announce that they will now be the sole US distributor for the high-quality hand-made wooden props produced by Martin Digmayer in the Czech Republic. These are individually laminated, carved, stained, and varnished to accurately represent the various full-scale propellers used on a multitude of WW1 aeroplanes. Each is matched to original manufacturer's data when available, and painstakingly re-created from photos and drawings when this information no longer exists.

The props pictured below are what's in stock. We will stock a limited number of props for each new release. Once this stock is depleted they will have to be ordered.

We can order almost any prop for most any WWI aircraft in scales from 1/72nd to 1/24th. They take approximately 6 weeks to receive, and payment is required when ordered. See the chart below for scales and prices.

To see pics of the props mentioned above follow the link above.