Trench Talk

Amy · 1 December 2003, 07:43 PM

I recently watched the British WWI movie The Trench. I'm not sure if I liked the movie or not due to the incessant cussing. There were more f-bombs than German bombs in that movie. It was so bad that the cussing drew away from the pertinent dialog.

Question: Was such cussing that prevalent back then, particularly the use of the f-word?

Michael · 1 December 2003, 08:49 PM

I don't profess to know a whole lot about WWI profanity. Not long before, "bloody" was regarded as swearing, and was common in the British Army of Kipling's day (he toned it down to "Bloomin'").

Robert Graves tells the story of a deputation of Welsh soldiers, coming to complain of the language their Sergeant used.

There is such a thing as "profanity creep". No one regards "hell", "damn", or "bloody" as hardcore swearing anymore, so that in order to make an impression you have to use the current word. This is nothing new - Shaw, in Pygmalion has Eliza at Ascot say "Not bloody likely", which would have been very shocking at the time. When My Fair Lady was adapted from it, the word had lost its shock value, so Eliza had to now say "Move your blooming ass!"

Not that I know anything about coarse language:

Is that what they mean by "Trench Mouth"?

Amy · 3 December 2003, 05:15 AM

Thanks Michael. I thought the same thing about "trench mouth". hee hee

Tailspin · 3 December 2003, 03:09 PM

Amy,

I don't think it's likely that the soldiers would use that particular word very often, but profanity would not be a stranger to them. These were often quite young men, away from home for the first time in their lives, and facing incredible peril. It's quite likely that they would have a coarse way of speaking. The particular word you describe is the same one Bruno Stachel has painted on the upper wing of his Fokker DVII in the book "The Blue Max." He has the profanity removed when a prisoner tells him the British aircrews are laughing about it.

There's rarely a time to use that word when another one won't do just as well, but if the whole German Army was attacking me, I might just utter it.

Tom

Michael · 4 December 2003, 07:38 PM

Despite the fact that the f word was criminally obscene well into my time, it certainly was common enough in the Second War. I'm wondering if it was the word of choice in the First, though, or whether the swearing was more profane than obscene.

stephen · 5 December 2003, 12:10 PM

That's what I was thinking... not that I know anything of the topic more than you guys... that verbal amateurism in that age may have been more gutter talk than actual profanity. Hmm.

Either way, I know what you mean about swearing in films, Amy. I could go to any bar in town for two hours and get sworn at for free... I don't need to pay for it.

Vigilant · 5 December 2003, 04:53 PM

I seem to recal that Mick Mannock would tend to say "Not Pygmalion likely!" in reference to the contemporary Bernard Shaw play (source: McScotch??). However, I doubt such delicacy was prevalent among other ranks, especially when bits of shrapnel were being wizzed at their heads.

IMO, "The Trench" added nothing to our understanding of WWI that hadn't been explored in "Journey's End" 70 years before.

Vig.

5 December 2003, 09:26 PM

I can't imagine that the the 'f' word, in particular, was in such common usage at that time; however, one could argue that the conflict, much like the Second World War, inspired the relaxation and even overthrow of many social codes- including vulgar and profane slang.

Some have noted the growth in popularity of the 'f' word after it was published in James Joyce's Ulysses in the c. 1922.

A related book, focusing on vernacular British 'trench song' is, 'When this Bloody War is Over', by Max Arthur, published in London, 2001.

Craig · 8 December 2003, 07:17 AM

It seems that no one who has posted really knows. But, it is a very old word, and soldiers have always been a rough lot, and though war has always been a rather dreadful thing, the trenches of WW1 raised the bar a bit. I wouldn't be at all surprised if the "trench talk" portrayed was accurate.

PeterL · 8 December 2003, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Craig@Dec 8 2003, 08:17 PM
[b] But, it is a very old word, and soldiers have always been a rough lot, and though war has always been a rather dreadful thing, the trenches of WW1 raised the bar a bit. I wouldn't be at all surprised if the "trench talk" portrayed was accurate.

I reckon so Craig. I am from a similar background to these lads, and spent five or six years in and around Hull where they all come from. Added to which my grandfather served in the trenches, and he was never lost for a word. It all sounds fairly authentic to me.