How cold is cold?

[Lufbery]

All,

Can anyone tell me what temperatures were like at various altitudes during the summer and winter? For instance, if it was 80°F at ground level, what was it at 5,000, 10,000, and 20,000 feet?

Alternately, if it was 20°F on the ground, what was the temp at regular patrol altitudes?

Thanks,

-Drew

[Volker_Nemsch]

If anyone can give an answer to this question, please include the temperature in degrees Celcius additionally (for most of the Europeans).

Temperature drop is about 5.4 degrees F for every 1,000ft.

On an 80F day, the temperatures at altitude would be:

5,000ft = 53F

10,000ft = 26F

20,000ft = -26F

Volker_Nemsch, I don't do F to C conversions off the top of my head, you'll have to do the math yourself!

[Lufbery]

Rex,

Thanks for the data. I've done some conversions and this is what I came up with:

Warm Weather Version:

Altitude Feet	Temp. Fahrenheit	Altitude Meters	Temp celsius
Ground Level	80	Ground Level	26.6
5,000	53	1,524	11.6
10,000	26	3,048	-3.3
20,000	-26	6,096	-32.2

Cold Weather Version:

Altitude Feet	Temp. Fahrenheit	Altitude Meters	Temp celsius
Ground Level	20	Ground Level	-6.6
5,000	-7	1,524	-21
10,000	-34	3,048	-36.6
20,000	-88	6,069	-66.6

Those last couple figures sound very suspect to me. Negative 88°F is awfully darned cold. I'll bet that the temperature change is not a straight change.

-Drew

I'll bet that the temperature change is not a straight change.

-Drew

No doubt you are correct. -5.4 degrees per 1,000 is a rule of thumb, not exact science.

Still, once you factor in the wind chill travelling through that air at approximately 60-90mph, you're talking serious cold!

[Barrett]

Without trying to address the physiological aspects, all I can say is that having logged some "quality" time in an open cockpit at 6,000 ft msl in December, it is just DAMN COLD! I suppose there's a quantitative difference between -7 and -30 but it may not be apparent to the aviator in question. The feet seem to be the first to "go," as extremities are most quickly effected. Unfeeling leaden blocks on the rudder pedals is about as eloquent a description as I could manage.
Breathing itself can become difficult, even painful. I never had a wool-lined mask such as some Great War guys used, but even with a warm scarp covering the face below the goggles it could be uncomfortable to inhale. Combine that with the burble off the top wing scientifically calculated to run down the back of your collar, and you're pretty dang miserable.
"Glamorous" open-cockpit biplanes usually are found in summer.

[Dan_San_Abbott]

Barrett:

Well put! *I also remember cabin jobs, such as the Curtiss "Robin" and the Ryan "Brougham" my father had were pretty miserable in winter without cabin heat. Frost bite was a major problem for aircrew in open cockpits. I remember flying into China from India and back and freezing my a-- of in khakis @ 20000 + ft.

The intelligence of a 20 year old is amazing! *Did not even have the brains to wear an A-2 jacket. Hell it was 110°F on the ground! Oh, well...........

Dan-San

[stephen]

Arthur G. Lee wrote of flying Pups at 18,000 feet in July. They would get dressed in their heavy flying suits when it was 90 degrees outside and be dripping with sweat by the time they took off. Twenty minutes later they were cold, and in extreme circumstances the sweat on the inside of their suits would freeze. After an hour or two of miserable cold, they would come back down and start sweating again a few thousand feet off the ground. By the time they could get out of their suits they were soaked in sweat again.

Alright, everybody say it together...

GROSS!

[Barrett]

Or, as an anonymous RFC pilot doubtless said, "If th' bleedin' 'uns wants to freeze their arses off at 20,000 bleedin' feet, more power to 'em!"

[Shooter]

Barrett, I have never had the honor of flying in an open cockpit, and all my flight hours were logged in the warmer seasons at altitude of less than 7,000 ft. *However, I have been above the Arctic Circle in December. Bodo, Norway is cold enough to freeze your spit before it hits the snow. Breathing can be *very painful.

Cold is not good.

Semper Fi,

Shooter sends