The Aerodrome Forum - Immelmann's E.IV

I apologize if you take offence with anyone disagreeing with you, Dan-San.

My issues were with one specific post.

Quote:

Jos:
The Fok.M5k was designed as scout/courier aircraft with a 80 Ps Oberursel U.O engine, Fokker put one machine gun, interrupter gear and ammuntion on board and reduced it's performance, and Iflieg put it into production as the Fok.E with a wing span od 8950 mm. The Fok E. was redesigned as a fighter, the wing area was reduced to 14 sq.meters and it went into production as the Fok E.II 2/15,(wn 222) still with the 80 Ps U.O engine and 1 M/G and with a wing span of 8520 mm. With the introduction of the Fok.E.II the Fok. E were redesignated Fok.E.I. When Fokker began receiving the 100 Ps U.I engines, they went into the Fok. E.II, the first was Fok.E.II 20/15 as the production standard. It was found that the E.II needed more wing, so the wing area was increased to 16 sq.m. on Fok.E.II66/15(wn317) and the span increased to 9520mm. The Fok. E.III was introduced with Fok. E.III54/15(wn 301) with a span of 9520. Both the E.II and the E.III bore the Fokker type designation as M.14. The Fok. E.IV120/15,(wn373 and type M.15) was introduced with a standard armament of 2 Maxin 08 machine guns. The span was 10000mm. At least one machine, Fok.E.IV189/16 issued to Ltn. Max Immelmann had 3 machine guns. This was an unsatisfactory arrangement, most were armed with 2 M/G parallel to the thrust line.
Blue skies
Dan-San

Do these Fokker data sheets really mention these specific aircraft by serial?

E. 54/15 was a standard production E.I with U.O engine. Re: Datafile 9, plate 75
E. IV 189/16 was a standard production E.IV, perhaps the last built, only 2 lMG 08's, ever. Re: MiniDatafile 7, page 9, middle photo.
E.2/15. I have never seen any reference to this aircraft, other than Peter Grosz listing it as an E.I that was accepted on May 31 1915 and shipped on June 21. Re: Datafile 91, page 9. Weyl is not reliable and not worth mentioning again.
I haven't yet run across a photo of E. II 66/15, but the overhead photo of E.II 38/15 shows typical, wide-span 13-rib (including root) wings. Re: Datafile 91 plate 58.

I would agree with you on the assessments of E.II 20/15 and E.IV 120/15.

You and I have hashed out the wing-span issue before so I'm not inclined to jump on that merry-go-round again. Perhaps we can agree to disagree for the time being?

When you say that the E.IIs started production still using the 80 hp U.O engine, are you referring to the prototype (w/n 257) that Fokker used at Stenay? Or are you saying that E (II) 20/15 and the E.II's that followed had U.O's as well?

Dan-San, I have great respect for all the years of research you've done and I've learned much from it. I am not trying to be combative or to discredit you. I do feel that there is another chapter (or more) to be added to this story and I am trying to get to the very bottom of it. I have had to revise my thinking time and time again as new information comes to light (again, just yesterday, as a matter of fact!). Unfortunately, I do not have access to the Fokker Data sheets, so I cannot speak to what they may or may not include. Do you have a copy that you would be willing to share, in the interest of historical accuracy? You can always PM me if you so desire.

Blue skies always to you, Dan-San.