Jastaschüle with Fokker Dr.I’s
 

Jastaschüle with Fokker Dr.I’s

Here is a list of known Fok.DR.I’s that had the Goebel Goe II 100hp training engine.
Does anyone have any information on these or any other DR.I’s sent to the Jastaschüle. Looking for dates, locations, pilots, photos and which Jastaschüle it was sent to.

405/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp (?) (Jasta 12 Ltn. Hermann Becker (23)) No Jastaschüle data
416/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp (?) (Jasta 12 Obltn. Paul Blumenbach (3)) No Jastaschüle data
422/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 13 Jastaschüle I
423/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 10 Jastaschüle (xx)?
424/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp (?) (Jasta 19) No Jastaschüle data
427/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 17 Jastaschüle (xx)?
434/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 32 Jastaschüle (xx)?
451/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 19 Jastaschüle 74?
524/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 24 Jastaschüle (xx)?
526/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 16 Jastaschüle (xx)?
528/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 18 Jastaschüle (xx)?
559/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 33 Jastaschüle (xx)?
560/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 26 Jastaschüle (xx)?
561/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 29 Jastaschüle (xx)?
565/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp (?) Jastaschüle (xx)?
566/17 Goebel Goe II 100hp 17 (Jasta 5)
Please let me know of other DR.I’s with the Goebel Goe II 100hp.
i.e.-The possible first trainer was Dr.I 108/17(StephenLawson)

Please note that planes like 405/17 I have recorded as a Goe II 100hp but yet it was also at Jasta 12. How can this be? Was it retired to the Jastaschüle after the D. VII was release in May of 1918?

Lloyd…

Jastaschule...
 

Lloyd,

Jastaschule not Jastaschüle... no umlaut!

Also, these aircraft were most likely not delivered with Goebel Goe. II engines originally to frontline units, but were later fitted with them as they passed from frontline to training units. The Dr.I was not already not powerful enough to compete at higher altitudes, the Goebel would have made this less so in frontline conditions.

Here is an idea also. The Oberursel Ur.II engines from the Dr.Is that transferred to training units may have been removed, and rebuilt/overhauled and used in other frontline aircraft including remaining Dr.I aircraft, and the Fokker D.VI and E.V programs which also needed the same engine type. They were already doing this with Mercedes D.III engines by upgrading older engines with new high compression pistons, etc. and resupplying them. Whose to say that is not the case with the Ur.II?

The Dr.I appeared at the Jastaschulen after the D.VII started being delivered. Dr.I aircraft were transferred to other units within the Jagdgeschwadern or Jagdgruppen before being sent to the Jastaschulen. This was to maintain supply until enough D.VII aircraft could replace them. Jasta 12, for example, flew the Dr.I well into the Summer months of 1918.

Cigogne:

I stand corrected it's Jastaschule but what is Jastaschulen?

As far as the Goebel Goe II 100hp training engine being installed at the factory or not. I would have to rely on the acceptance reports that has the engine numbers listed. I think this is because of the later production Dr.I's were being shipped in April of 1918, this is also the month that a large number of D. VII's were also being accepted. I think that Fokker know at that time that the Dr.I was going to be withdrawn from the front so that’s why he started to put the training engines in them.

I do agree with you that when the D. VII's came to the front, then some of the Dr.I's would have most likely had the engines removed before sending them to the Jastaschulen.

Lloyd...


Lloyd...

Lloyd,

"die Jastaschule" (singular) but "die Jastaschulen" (plural)

like

the apple (sing.) but the apples (pl.)


BTW the old German Sütterlin-Schrift writes the letter "u" with a little bow over the "u" - that is not an "ü" (or "ue") but it is easy to misinterpret as an "ü" if the reader thinks the bow is the same as the two dots in "ü".

If anybody tries to know more about the old German writing then he should search for terms like Sütterlin, Kurrent or Offenbacher Schrift (with Google or other search machines). These are three versions of the old German Schrift. If you can find examples in the net then - enjoy the torture! :p

I think the link was posted in an earlier thread already but it could be helpful for researcher who work with German original documents:

http://www.album1900.com/suetterlin/suetterlin.php

Thanks Rammjaeger:

That's good info to have.

Lloyd...

Just reading the first half of the Narichtenblatt is tough enough.

I would agree with this and I will still fall back on what I mention before. "the later production Dr.I's were being shipped in April of 1918, this is also the month that a large number of D. VII's were also being accepted. I think that Fokker know at that time that the Dr.I was going to be withdrawn from the front so that’s why he started to put the training engines in them."

From the Dr.I's I have listed according to the acceptance reports, four in April and six in May. This just reinforces my thought that Fokker knew the Dr.I's where going to be withdrawn. Since the D.VII's where going in full production Fokker just had to complete the order so he could concentrate on the D.VII's.

Lloyd...

April 1918... the Dr.I wasn't withdrawn from the front. They continued to be used through late summer in some units. They were replaced when D.VIIs became available, but were then often shipped to other units who flew the same type in order to maintain supply because of attrition. Others went to the Jastaschulen, but I don't think they were factory fresh examples. They were all ex-frontline aircraft. Photos show that the three JGs had them as equipment well into the Summer. In JG.I Jastas 4 and 6 continued to use them, with Jasta 4 being the last unit to fly them as Jastas 6, 10, and 11 upgraded to D.VIIs. Jasta 5, which was in the same Jagdgruppe as JG.I received Jasta 11 cast offs as did Jastas 34b and 35b. In JG.II, the same held true. Jastas 12, 13, and 19 using them into the Summer, with Jasta 12 being the last to be fully equipped with it well into the Summer. Jasta 14 flew them in full squadron strength at least into late July. JG.III had them well into the Summer as well, w/ a mixture of aircraft seen in Jasta 27 photos, Jasta 26, Jasta 36, and Jasta Boelcke. Jasta 36 had examples in late July and even into August when Fokker E.Vs are seen in some photos along with Fokker Dr.Is, and not just in ones and twos.

I don't think Fokker would have substituted engines on his own... he had government contracts to fulfil. It is a "Weylism" to think he would pull a "bait and switch." He would have had to deliver what was specified in the contracts. Dan-San has written that the Fokker Dr.I was a "stop-gap" design. He is right. Fokker was already working on several designs simultaneously to succeed it even as far back in August 1917.